When I think back on the late 1970's and my time working at Max's Kansas City, particular memories always come to mind. When I think of those times, I remember clearly the day that my dear friend Leee Childers brought the Rockats to the club. He came bouncing in, blue eyes twinkling mischievously as always, with a group of the cutest boys I'd ever seen. Leee said: "Donna, I've got lots of meetings to attend today, I trust you'll look after this lot." Of course I said, "No problem at all." That day we had a few laughs, a few burgers and I would be friends with those boys for years after. Smutty, in my opinion, was the cutest and most charming of the bunch. He was, then, a cross between the Artful Dodger and a young Alain Delon. Sincerely, not much has changed about his looks today. Recently, I caught up with him to talk about his new book: Smutty: "The Only Essex Boy in Warhol's Factory" among other things...


What were your first impressions of New York and your early days in the big city?

I think all of our first feelings were feelings of extreme awe. We had been to Los Angles and did not know what to expect, but Manhattan was a real Gotham City! And to be taken to the world famous Max's Kansas City where The New York Dolls and so many big bands came out of was very thrilling for us young, London Rockabillies.

Before we arrived in New York, I met Gail in London and we started dating, much to my mother's consternation as she saw Gail and Leee as a threat. We became even closer during our crazy journey to New York and without her help I never would have made it there.

Gail, kindly, invited me to stay at her apartment. The apartment seemed like a palace. This wasn't long before we decided to get married. Our wedding and pictures made it to the cover of the Soho Weekly News. Johnny Thunders, Walter Lure and The Stray Cats all showed up at our wedding. I even had a stag night at The Mudd Club with my old mates from Essex! I owe much to Gail. She taught me a lot about life as well as the music business. At last I was living in New York... I had arrived!

At first the rest of the band were not so lucky, although we all ended in nice places in the end: Dibbs later lived with the biggest supermodel of the time, Carrie Nygeren, in one of Bowie's old places on beautiful West 18th Street. But that was still to come. For now, the rest of them ended up in "The Blondie Loft". Of course when you think of Debbie Harry and Blondie you think it must have been an amazing place. It was, but not because it would look good in an interiors magazine.

Leee was working with Bob Gruen for Rock Scene, the super hip music magazine run by Lisa Robinson. She loved us and helped the band get temporary digs and rehearsal space at the loft, right by CBGB. We'd met Debbie and Chris Stein quite a few times at Leee's in London, where they had their first hit. Now in New York they were spearheading the new Power Punk movement. At first the deal was we could only use it to rehearse our opening gig at Max's Kansas City with the Cramps. Even Leee didn't realise that our timing was perfect. Before we really knew what was happening, Chris and Debbie had moved out and Levi and the Rockats in. You couldn't beat the location.

The Blondie Loft was in a huge, iron clad, old factory type building on the corner of Houston and Bowery. More importantly it was next to the only 24 hours liquor store for blocks. It was 1978 and crawling with winos, junkies, hookers and drag queens. Leee loved it and told me not to worry, so I didn't, even though it was hardly Southend-on-Sea. They say location, location, location but the loft was really disgusting with stench ridden hardwood floors. The rehearsal space was tiny and stank like a Chinese wrestler's jockstrap, with mouldy carpet on the walls. The toilet was worse than you could imagine or describe. The whole place was rat and roach infested. You had to sleep with a torch, for fear of being bitten or roaches crawling on your face. It was hard to believe that this was where Blondie practised. The Cramps, Chris Spedding from the Necessaries and Richard Lloyd from Television all practised downstairs. Then soon after we moved in, Richard came upstairs completely nodding out on heroin. I might have been naive but I knew a junkie when I saw one. We couldn't believe he was in Television. He was a complete mess. He tried to scare us by saying the shutters were put on the windows when Blondie were there because a sniper had been shooting at the windows from across the street. He was really fucked up all the time. To make things get even worse our drummer Dean Thomas had a dog called Lou, and Richard hated it. We used to have little acoustic jams with brushes on the drums. Richard would race upstairs and start screaming at Levi and Dibbs. One night we had all been drinking heavily and were much too loud even for a junkie.

Richard came running upstairs, barefoot, smacked up and threatening us with a World War One bayonet. He was running right through a big steamy shit courtesy of Lou. Luckily he nodded off before he could do any damage. He came up again waving a flick knife but we were tooled up by then. We were so drunk that we were half laughing and half scared. Next day we told Leee, but he brushed it off as "just a minor detail darling".

The very last straw was when one morning Dibs went to take a shit. He was only half awake but he suddenly realised there was a strange noise right beneath him. He looked down and saw three rats trying to climb out of the toilet bowl. He was so freaked out he ran back into the loft screaming that a fucking rat in the toilet had nearly bitten off his balls! ??We had hit a real low point. We had no money, very little food, and no equipment. I could never understand how Leee could remain so calm. We trusted him. He had worked with great bands. He was our manager. He just never seemed bothered. Or was he just hiding his worries so as not to scare the living shit out of us? He just said he had a plan and a big surprise . . .

There was one time when it really got to me. I remember talking to him alone, almost in tears. I was missing my mum who was doing her nut back in Essex. She was trying to get anyone who would listen to help her get Leee arrested for stealing her son.

I turned to Leee and said "Is this what the music business is really like?" He tried to reassure me: "Smutty my darling boy, everyone that I have worked with, including David Bowie and Iggy Pop, have been through this or worse, honey. It's called paying your dues." It calmed me down, and then to cheer us up he promised us a really good meal and that we would meet somebody very famous.


You guys must have gotten so close during those lean years...Thinking of your history with them, how did you come to hook up with Levi and form a band? How did you get together with Leee who would become your manager? What were your feelings about Levi leaving the band?

I actually met Levi at a 'Rock 'N ' Roll roller skating rink around 1974-75. It was in Southend-on Sea, Essex in England above a well-established Teddy boy hang out called The Pier Bar. I was still too young to get in but I loved the Rockabilly music coming from the bar. Levi and I were often mistaken for brothers around the town. We fast became friends, sharing our love of style and music. Shortly after we met, Levi moved in with my family at my house in Basildon, Essex. I first met Leee Black Childers at his house in Islington in North London. At that time he was the manager for The Heartbreakers, featuring Johnny Thunders and Jerry Nolan from The New York Dolls. They were touring on the Anarchy tour with The Clash, Sex Pistols and other bands. My first introduction to Punk was arriving at Leee's house to meet the likes of Debbie Harry and The Ramones and many more. I must say coming from a totally fifties retro background, I was taken back but soon became fast and close friends with all of them!

Leee was from the old school of Hollywood thought and believed that you could spot a shining star early on. His philosophy was that he could mold, teach and groom raw talent into something amazing and market it to a mass audience. I personally feel that if I had not met him, I would maybe have not chosen the path that I took. He has been and still is like a father figure to me. I owe so much to his old school of thought. He was a star maker in every sense of the word.


What brought you to Rockabilly music initially and who were some of your earliest influences in music? The Rockats has been described as a band that blended Punk Rock with Rockabilly. Do you feel that that description is an accurate one? If so, who were some of your Punk influences?

I do actually feel the "Rockats" and "Levi and The Rockats'' were initially a Rockabilly band, but having seen The Heartbreakers in London and The Damned and Siouxie and the Banshees, we fell in love with the fresh and raw sound of Punk so we kind of fused the two together. The first band I can remember seeing was "Crazy Cavan and The Rhythm Rockers". They were to play years later at Max's with Buzz and the Flyers. They were a Welsh Teddy- Boy band... I lied about my age to get in to the club to see them and was blown away. I knew at that moment that I was hooked on Rock n 'Roll and nothing else mattered. It must have been at the Pier Bar in Essex around 1974.

As for me personally, my heaviest influences were Johnny Thunders and Paul Siminon as well as my Rockabilly favorites like Gene Vincent and Eddie Cochran.

You've played shows with some of the biggest names in Rock and Roll. Tell us what was the most exciting bill you've been on? Who impressed you musically? Who impressed you on a personal level? Is there anyone who didn't impress you at all?

I have played with some of the biggest names in Rock'n'Roll and have been fortunate enough to actually hang out with a few of my biggest musical influences. I immediately think of opening for David Bowie At Hershey Stadium in Pennsylvania and of course the infamous gigs with The Clash in Times Square. We played a lot of shows at the Ritz in Manhattan, our manager Jerry Brandt owned it. The list is fairly long but the ones I really enjoyed were, Tina Turner, Kiss, The Pretenders, Talking Heads,The Specials, The Go Go's, The Cramps, The Senders. Siouxie and The Banshees and of course, Iggy Pop. We also played with Squeeze, Joan Jett, The Ramones, Adam and The Ants....Little Richard, Dick Dale, Robert Gordon...and the list goes on!


Wow! That's a pretty impressive list! The Stray Cats were heavily influenced by the Rockats, and had a hit with Stray Cat Strut. Some people (myself included) say that it was the Rockats who were more deserving of that hit. What are your thoughts on Brian Setzer and the Stray Cats?

I have no qualms about talking about my relationship with Brian, Slim Jim and Lee Rocker. I met them very early on hanging out with them, I think your brother Jimmy Destri was doing something with The Bloodless Pharoahs. Brian was in that band. I believe it might have even been Jimmy who introduced us. We were good mates at the time. The Stray Cats actually came to Gail and my wedding uptown at Ashley's.., Johnny Thunders, Jerry Nolan and Walter Lure were there too, and probably Abbijane. Janis Caffaso was Maid of Honor and Dibbs Preston was my Best Man. Later, they asked me to come to Massapequa to see them at a shit little pub, called Heckle and Jeckles. I went back a few times and jammed once and cut and styled their hair, sold them a Teddy Boy drape or two...But I knew then Brian really had something...just amazing on guitar. Being in a band, as you know, well a lot of it is being in the right place at the right time. The Stray Cats hit London at exactly at the right moment...and good for them.

I have since played in "13 Cats" with Slim Jim for years on and off...if there was any animosity then, it is certainly water under the bridge now. Love them all.


You studied at HB studios. Was it your intention to be an actor before a musician? I also remember you and the guys filming a major motion picture in Florida: "Where the Boys Are" I believe. What was that experience like?

I always liked certain actors and obviously living in Hollywood a few times over twelve years actually, I did a few bits, and was in a few underground movies. I also art directed a few as well as working as an assistant director. I went to two different acting schools. However, I found most of the class mates shallow and boring people, so I went back to music. Making "Where The Boys are'' was fun and I got to shag one of the lead actresses all night so it was fun...at least I think so.


Hmmm...I was there remember, but I won't tell Ginger who it was, don't worry. Andy Warhol was and remains sort of an enigma. What was your experience working with him like?

I was first introduced to Andy Warhol by Leee Black Childers. The whole band ''Levi and The Rockats'' went to the Factory together. If I remember correctly, we were not that excited. We thought he was just one of Leee's old mates..Leee told us that Andy always put on nice lunches and we were always starving hungry back then. Andy was very polite and strange at the same time. Looking back now, I think he was an observational type of person, just taking everything in. He really liked us and I hung out there several times with some of the guys and on my own.

One time he said to me ''Smutty can you take your shirt off so I can take a picture of you?'' And I said ''What are you going to give me?'' He laughed and asked: "What do you want ?" So I said a book signed or something, so he gave me a book...Another time I asked: "Why don't you draw something on me and I will get it tattooed"?. So he did. He drew a small champagne glass with a girl in it. It was in bic pen. So I was going to get it done the next day but that night, I got really drunk, woke up and looked at Andy's drawing and it was a blur! So I never got it done... Haha... could have had an original piece of art...oh well.


You've been photographed by the biggest names in the business, yet you're not at all affected by your beautiful and iconic face...What are your thoughts on beauty and popular culture?

I had been a model actually, not for a long time, but in the early 1980's I signed to Click Models in New York and did runway stuff for Betsy Johnson and Steven Sprouse. I also did some shoots for German Vogue and Italian Vogue but I would like to say to those people who personally know me, not my fans but actual friends and family like you Donna, I did not have much of anything growing up. I had an absent father who I still don't talk to, and my sister and I grew up on the council projects in Essex UK, I always knew I was different and good looking, I found a way out through music and my mentor Leee Childers. Leee taught me a lot of things; most importantly he taught me how to be humble and grateful for what you have, so I am. I think people today have lost that special trait. There is certainly a lack of gratitude and humility in today's culture.


You're now a family man (with a stunningly beautiful family, I might add) living in Iceland. What is life like there and how did a city boy like you come to live there?

I have previously lived in Manhattan, Long Island, Hollywood, Miami and London, I also was lucky to have lived in each of those places before they became gentrified and boring, full of rich "trustafarians" and hipsters...and now I prefer to live in a place when you can park, breathe the air and not be bothered by anyone. NYC and London I work in often and it's enough for my city quota. My lovely younger wife and two boys have kept me there and also helps me behave somewhat haha.


You're also at the helm of a successful radio show. What is it like working behind the scenes in music?

I really enjoy my two radio shows here , plus its live and uncensored!, I can play whatever I want from The Cramps to Gene Vincent...and take interviews. I recently interview Clem Burke and Glen Matlock as well as Leee Childers.


What genres of music are you playing on your show these days? Do you spotlight upcoming bands in Iceland?

I really listen to a lot more music genres now, I got into Punk more, some Metal, Goth and a few other things, but I'm still really attracted to the Rockabilly rawness and early New York glam Rock and Punk from the Max's and CBGB's days such as The New York Dolls, Lou Reed, Suicide and The Heartbreakers...I guess you can't teach an old dog?


You have a book coming out about your life. Can you give Punk Globe readers a hint about what to expect in that book? Will you change names to protect the guilty?

I am coming out with a book called ''Smutty Smiff The only Essex Boy in Andy Warhol's Factory'' I met Andy through Leee and did a cable show early on With Debbie Harry interviewing Levi and The Rockats. As far as a timeline looking back, I firmly believe that my early career with meeting Leee and Gail, coming to New York in 1979 are the most exciting times for me to talk about, hanging out in my late teens at now historic clubs like Mudd Club, CBGB's, Max's and The Peppermint Lounge, Dancerteria...and The Ritz a bit later. They were certainly good times.

I have done some questionable things and experimented in a few areas in my life and undoubtedly, I will have to change names to protect the innocent. However, this book is as "Sex , Drugs and Rock'n Roll as it gets! I have lived the life, burnt my candle at both ends, partied, drank with and had sex with more people than I can possibly remember... Would I change it all now?? The answer is no.